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Dan Brown's Novels >> Deception Point

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Arras
enthusiast


Reged: 05/24/04
Posts: 263
Loc: B.C., Canada
Re: Improvised Munitions new [Re: Iceal]
      #7441 - 04/15/06 08:36 AM

Quote:

Iceal said:
is it possible to find any pictures of that kind of weapons?





Not any real weapons of that sort, no, since they don't exist. Contrary to Brown's claim at the beginning of the book that "all technologies described in this book exist", his interpretation of "improvised munitions" has taken the concept a bit further than current science and technology allows. The same applies to most of the other technologies he describes in the book, including the "microbot" and "hologram gun". He basically did what any science-fiction author does--he looked at technologies that are currently at the drawing-board stage and extrapolated forward 10-15 years to imagine what these things might be like if/when they mature.

There are a number of practical problems with the improvised munitions weapons as Brown describes them:

(1) Forging the ammunition itself would require a source of energy, either to heat sand or cool snow into ice. A battery could power a heating/refrigerating unit, sure, but then the battery becomes the weak link in the supply chain and the weapon becomes useless when the battery dies, defeating the purpose of "infinite ammo". In the case of turning sand to glass, you'd need a heating element capable of reaching about 1500 degrees Celsius, which would require an impractically large power source (to say nothing of the insulation on the weapon's grips to protect the holder from nasty burns, and from melting other parts of the weapon). The other problem with in-weapon forging of ammunition is that it would be painfully slow--the time between shots would be on the order of minutes, not seconds, so for all intents and purposes it would be a one-shot weapon.

(2) Firing the newly-forged ammunition would in most cases destroy the projectile. In the case of an ice bullet, the heat of friction as the bullet traveled down the barrel would melt it (the Discovery Channel program Mythbusters debunked this one quite a while ago). Any part of the ice bullet that doesn't melt in the barrel would shatter upon impact, even against unprotected skin, because the sharpness of the point will have been dulled, and ice is quite fragile. Glass bullets are a bit more practical as ammunition, but the forging problem all but rules them out.

In the "real" world, "improvised munitions" refers to things like Molotov cocktails, recipes for making gunpowder out of commonly-available ingredients, using construction supplies like nails in creative ways, and so on. The U.S. Department of Defense TM 31-210 Improvised Munitions Handbook is a training manual for guerilla warfare, for instance, but it makes no references to any weapons that forge their own ammunition.

Simply put, Brown's concept of "improvised munitions" represents something that the militaries of the world would probably like to have--unlimited ammo in the field is a long-held dream of war-planners everywhere--but technological obstacles and scientific realities make them impractical at this point. Check back in 10-15 years, though!

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ash
journeyman


Reged: 11/29/05
Posts: 74
Loc: Bombay India
Re: Improvised Munitions new [Re: Arras]
      #7489 - 04/20/06 07:12 PM

Even the simple navigation equipment described is quite futuristic.Dan seems to have penchant for declaring in the beginning of the book everytime that all state is fact.
In case of DVC it was religious so caused such a furore

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8549176320abc
enthusiast


Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 219
Loc: UK
Re: Improvised Munitions new [Re: ash]
      #7549 - 04/23/06 05:46 AM

Anyone who would use Dan Brown's novels as a reference book needs to be hit.

--------------------
Governments offer us safety for our freedom. It is by seeing this safety as false that we are freed.

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SephiaModerator
Supreme Goddess


Reged: 11/28/03
Posts: 876
Loc: MA, USA
Re: Improvised Munitions new [Re: 8549176320abc]
      #7557 - 04/23/06 08:46 AM

oh, I wouldn't go quite that far. Brown's books, while certainly not a reliable reference, are a good starting point. Isn't that how most of us started? We read Brown's books, saw his claim that the stuff was real, and did further research...

--------------------
"Your life is yours alone, rise up and live it" ~Terry Goodkind

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8549176320abc
enthusiast


Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 219
Loc: UK
Re: Improvised Munitions new [Re: Sephia]
      #7577 - 04/25/06 07:15 AM

Yes I supose.

--------------------
Governments offer us safety for our freedom. It is by seeing this safety as false that we are freed.

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CMWarren
newbie


Reged: 05/25/06
Posts: 35
Re: Improvised Munitions [Re: Sephia]
      #8054 - 06/10/06 08:14 PM

Quote:

Sephia said:
all glass is made from melted sand.




I cringed big time when I read about the glass bullets, because its not feasable for many reasons.

I am a glass artist, so I deal with hot glass all the time, and even so, at the tempatures for basic kiln working being in the range of 1450-1750 F, I do not see how they could make a gun that would be able to power high enough to get to those tempatures. and thats not even high enought to melt sand.

to melt sand, you are talking about in the range of 3500degrees F and up, depending on the sand itself. and ususally, to melt at that tempature, you have to add other things, such as soda lime, which is a refractory chemeical that will retain the heat to help the sand melt faster.

the idea of putting this into a gun uint, and have it melt sand, then cool it fast enough to fire is ludicrise, because glass itself is a very touchy substance. even in small sizes like the size of a marble, you have to cool it down slowly, other wise, if you shot it out the end of the gun within minutes of it being forged, the glass would cool so fast after leaving the gun that it would fracture, and explode nearly immediatly, due to the huge stress caused by the quick cooling.

glass is a tricky meduim becuase you have to cool it very slowly, so that the inside of the glass and the outside cools as close to the same rate as possible. this is a slow prosses. even when I am doing meybe 2-3 layers less then a centameter in total, it takes hours. if you dont, the glass will have a huge ammount of stress inside, and then would crack and completely to relive the stress.

glass is not feasable, unless the gun produces and stores the bullets days before they are needed. even so, plan sand is unstable, which is why most all glass itself has other addatives to make it stronger, and to make it easier to melt.

I can see snow guns, that makes sense, as those water guns, as they often use powerful jets of waters to cut materials instead of saws which an break and warp.

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